Cooled seats asbuilts

Car configuration discussions and experience sharing
tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:00 am

Hi all. I’ve been on a mission to make my cooled seats work to the best of their ability on my 2015 Edge Sport. The seat bottom works pretty good. The back needs help. I’ve already added the ductwork on the intake and exhaust, which made a huge difference. But it’s still not great.
If you aren’t aware of how the heated/cooled seats function, read about that first before continuing :D
Monitoring the PIDs for the seat cusion and backrest for both seats, the cushions get around 60* and the backrests get around 70*, no matter the ambient temperature.
I did a search and found that ford put out a tsb for configuration of the SCME, to fix poor cooling of the seat cusion and backrest. I plugged in forscan and looked at the data in my SCME and compared it to the as built data that was provided by motor craft. The data in my SCME was slightly different in some blocks than what the as built data that the website listed for my VIN. So I changed it and tested. This change increased the fan speed of the blowers, by a lot. It also dropped the TED(thermoelectric device) temperature some, to about 56* on the cusion and 64* on the backrest. But still, the backrest is not as great as the cusion. I still, after checking everything inside the seat, can sometimes feel no cold on the backrest. But other times it works.
On heat mode, the TEDs can get up to 140*/140* cusion and backrest. And the air being exhausted is frigid. On cool mode, the TED temp is around 56*/64* with the TSB done, but the exhaust air is lukewarm. Having messed around with TEDs before, this tells me that the TEDs in cool mode are not getting full power. One side is not more efficient then the other. For example, say 12v is applied to a TED, top side gets say 150*, bottom side gets 30*. When voltage is reversed, top side should get 30* and bottom 150*.
There is a PID for driver and passenger seat mode, it lists max_cool as an option but it will never be on max_cool. Only open_loop_cool. But it will go to max_heat.
I got to thinking, maybe the Lincoln MKX cooled seats get colder, because it’s a Lincoln.

Here’s my question: I’ve changed the asbuilt data in a few different modules to enable/disable features, but followed what people said to do.
I’ve looked up the asbuilts by VIN for a 2015 and 2016 MKX, and a 2018 Edge Sport and compared it to my 2015 Edge Sport. Some blocks are the same, and the ones that are different appear to be similar(as far as I can tell). If I change the asbuilts of my SCME to the asbuilts of the MKX SCME to see if they get colder: if something is wrong, will I be able to change it back to my Edge’s configuration and be back to normal? Or will it do damage? What else could be damaged if I only change the blocks related to the SCME

omar302
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:50 am
Vehicle: Ford Edge, Gasoline 2.7L/335hp, 2016

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by omar302 » Fri Aug 31, 2018 9:56 am

That is interesting. I also noticed the temperature difference in the PIDs.

Regarding your question on using the MKX's ABD values, you can always revert back to original values. But this doesn't mean it would revert any harm done, if any.

Also looking at the part numbers, it seems the Edge uses the same part used in the MKX (2016+), F150 (2015+) and Explorer (2016+). So I guess any of their ABDs should not cause harm.

Last, on your comment of the TSB changing the ABD, I found TSB 16-0080 which applies to the 2015-2016 Edge & 2016 Explorer instructs that only the Explorer requires reprogramming of the SCME, not the Edge. Furthermore, note that this TSB only applies to vehicles built before 02-Dec-16 because the fix became default from factory.

I am still waiting for the exhaust parts from Tim, ordered them more than a month ago, too many delays. I didn't want to change the factory intake in order to keep the warranty in case I need it as I have a 5 year warranty.

What were your ABD values & changes you made? I'll try to get mine (2016 Edge Sport) and the temperature values when I can.

omar302
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:50 am
Vehicle: Ford Edge, Gasoline 2.7L/335hp, 2016

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by omar302 » Fri Aug 31, 2018 4:48 pm

OK, so my Edge's ABD for the SCME is attached. This is stock with the TSB fix applied from the factory. After a ~30 minute drive, ForScan showed 73°F for the back & 59°F for the bottom. This is stock as I still don't have the exhaust part fix.

Edit: Did you check the F-150 MOD sheet? It has a tab for the SCME. Might have something useful for your trials.
PartialScreenshot_20180831-194321.png
PartialScreenshot_20180831-194321.png (470.17 KiB) Viewed 1763 times

tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Sat Sep 01, 2018 2:39 am

Yep I saw it was the same part number between a few vehicles. I do also see that that TSB says that the backrest blower on the edge should be replaced if it was built before that date, not sure which date off hand, but I know mine is a january 2015 and it was built before the date.

My ABD with the TSB fix is the same as you posted. It is also the same ABD for the 2018 Edge Sport. My original ABD is this:
originial ABD.JPG
originial ABD.JPG (325.05 KiB) Viewed 1755 times
Im going to try putting in the ABD from the 2015 MKX. Which is this:
2015 MKX.png
2015 MKX.png (77.02 KiB) Viewed 1755 times
and will report back with PID temps.
Currently with the updated ABD, after 30 minutes today the cushion was 58* and the backrest was 64*. And the noticeable difference with the TSB added was the fan speed, which also brought temps down a few degrees on the backrest. I also installed Tims kit before I started tinkering with the seats.

Also I have not checked the F150 mod sheet. Is that on the F150 forum in that extensive cooled seats thread or in a collective forscan thread? A link would be helpful Ill definitely look into it.
Attachments
2015 MKX.png
2015 MKX.png (77.02 KiB) Viewed 1755 times

omar302
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:50 am
Vehicle: Ford Edge, Gasoline 2.7L/335hp, 2016

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by omar302 » Sat Sep 01, 2018 5:39 am

It is this sheet for the 2015-2018 F-150:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/ ... 0/htmlview#

I noticed in your attachment for the MKX that the file name is 2015 MKX, remember that the 2015 MKX is the older model. The MKX was redesigned in 2016 and is the model that shares the platform with the 2015+ Edge.

tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:47 pm

Yes that is the ABD for the 2015 MKX. This is a 2016. Doesn't seem to be compatible at all with the 2015-2018 Edge-
The attachment 2016 MKX.png is no longer available
Attachments
2016 MKX.png
2016 MKX.png (68.87 KiB) Viewed 1743 times

tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Sat Sep 01, 2018 1:49 pm

I checked out the data sheet for the f150. I think I am starting to make sense of it, if I am even doing it right. I converted the hex to decimal and came up with this for the low/medium/high set points. If Im correct on converting this, it is blower voltage in % and duty cycle in %? In my observation the SCME doesn't seem to have a temperature set point on cool mode, seems to just put voltage to the TED with a duty cycle, and what you get for temperature is what you get.
When I try to convert the blocks for high heat, I don't get a temp anywhere close to 180*. I used my heat this morning, and the highest I saw on the PID for both cushion and backrest were around 180 on heat setting 3. So I am not convinced I am converting things correctly. Still trying to make sense of all this.
EDIT- I just found a converter page to convert hex to celsius, then when converted to fahrenheit, the high heat target temp comes to 179*. So that is close to what the PID shows for high heat temp. Ill test this on medium and low.
Convert.png
Convert.png (45.11 KiB) Viewed 1741 times
Last edited by tmarsh on Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Sat Sep 01, 2018 2:06 pm

I may try and probe the TED wires to find out the voltage and duty cycle on each setting. Here are the schematics for the driver seat.
Screen Shot 2018-09-01 at 9.18.29 AM.png
Screen Shot 2018-09-01 at 9.18.29 AM.png (128.85 KiB) Viewed 1740 times
I tried to find the pinout for the black connector to the backrest blower that is directly under the seat for easy access, but that connector is not listed in the system. Only the giant connectors for the entire seat. But If you go by wire colors you are fine, the only wires in that connector are for the blower.

omar302
Posts: 138
Joined: Sat Apr 16, 2016 4:50 am
Vehicle: Ford Edge, Gasoline 2.7L/335hp, 2016

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by omar302 » Sat Sep 01, 2018 3:37 pm

Wish good luck, but I believe the seat back was set to lower cooling than the bottom for 2 reasons. There are purely my guess.
1) a too cold seat back can cause back aches unlike the bottom.
2) no matter what you do, there is no escaping the fact that the seat bottom being open to the floor will have better efficiency compared to the back being closed.

tmarsh
Posts: 7
Joined: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:43 am
Vehicle: 2015 Ford Edge Sport

Re: Cooled seats asbuilts

Post by tmarsh » Sat Sep 01, 2018 4:05 pm

I agree with both of those. It is a smaller blower and TED assembly than the cushion is also.
In my case, Id actually prefer my back to be colder than my butt. It feels so good when the backrest gets super cold out of nowhere.
The ductwork to the backrest blower definitely helps ventilate though, I wish you luck on your instal when you get Tim's kit. And I believe you saw my info post on the Edge forum for an easy way to install, but for others who may be lurking it can be found here on page 8: http://www.fordedgeforum.com/topic/1879 ... d%20+seats&

Post Reply